How South Dallas arts leaders are connecting their institutions & learning the city’s history

In this clip from our South Dallas Arts Leaders Roundtable, VanAnthony Williams, general manager of the South Dallas Cultural Center; Lisa Brown Ross, president and CEO of the African American Museum of Dallas; and Nijeul X, executive and artistic director of Forest Forward, share how their institutions intersect and how they’re continuing to learn from the histories of both South Dallas and their own organizations.

🎥 Watch the full roundtable discussion here.

Transcript

Nijeul X: How do we build structural support entities that may not exist? That may allow the institutions to live 50 years into the future? “Seven generations into the future” is what I’ve been telling people. That’s what I’m excited about as well, because I feel like those things can live even beyond the institution, because they can impact the community in ways that I think will be very much long lasting. 

VanAnthony Williams: Yeah.

Lisa Brown Ross: I do too. 

How do your institutions intersect, and how might they connect in the future?

Lisa Brown Ross: It’s interesting though that you asked that question, because I feel in this moment that I know you. And that we’ve known each other, that we have been in this place before, even though we haven’t. But I think that speaks to the work. I think it speaks to the desires of our hearts. I think it speaks to our commitment and dedication. So when we say that this is so much bigger than us, for me, what that looks like is I want to ensure that the African American Museum is around for another 50 years. “Perpetuity” is my word. I want to make sure that my grandchildren’s children can walk through that museum and receive the education that they need, the inspiration, that they can look at the photos and the artwork and see themselves. That we can invite dancers in, and theater. We were talking before you got here, Nijeul, and that this moment is organic. It is purposeful. And I’m really looking forward to working and drilling down how we can develop programs together and collaborate for something that will impact the community. I think that we are standing on a gold mine for our community, and not just for the African American community, but the diversity of voices, the diversity of skin, and it’s something that is truly a blessing that we’re here at this time together. It’s not an accident. 

VanAnthony Williams: And just to touch on the collaborative aspect– I want, and I hope, and I dream that our institutions collaborate. Meaning that beyond the three of us, there’s a lasting impact and a lasting collaborative spirit in our institutions that start with us. 

Nijeul X: It does. I mean, I’m honored to be at the table, one, because your institutions are actually the models that have been speaking to me through folks I’ve been meeting with. They talk about going to both of these institutions, raising their children in these institutions, and the memories they hold. I know that I’m excited to collaborate and build, because I feel like historically, we’ve been here before in some ways. I know I’ve been calling on history a lot as I think about how the Forest comes to life. And there’s a way in which our spaces can be so coordinated and support each other so we don’t have to do anything in isolation. Which, I’m not interested in doing anything else in isolation. A way in which we can really maximize on resources– both human resources, but also the things that make all of our institutions go round. You know? How do we build structural support entities that may not exist? That may allow the institutions to live 50 years into the future? “Seven generations into the future” is what I’ve been telling people. That’s what I’m excited about as well, because I feel like those things can live even beyond the institution, because they can impact the community in ways that I think will be very much long lasting. 

VanAnthony Williams: Yeah.

Lisa Brown Ross: I do too. What a gift we’ve been given.

VanAnthony Williams Everyday.

Lisa Brown Ross: What a gift. Treasure.

What parts of South Dallas history and your institution’s history are you still learning and hoping to understand better? 

Lisa Brown Ross: I shared that I’m still having conversations with Dr. Robinson, which is very important to me. First of all, that he trusts me. When I think about that, I get a little weepy sometimes – that this 84-year-old man who built this institution from the ground up is willing to hand the leadership over to me. So, like you said, I don’t take that lightly. One of the things in my conversations, that I promised him that I would build upon, is one of the exhibits in our museum on the Freedmen’s town, and the history of Dallas, the history of black Dallas, the history of South Dallas. That’s one thing that I definitely want to expand, and I’ve made a promise to him that that’s one of the visions or the goals that we have to provide a space of healing for South Dallas residents that they can come to and see. These are our ancestors, these are the stores that we had, here are the bakeries, and the businesses, and of the life, the humanity, that we had at one time in South Dallas. So, that’s one of the gifts that I see myself kind of involving our institution in. And building upon that, as far as the community, and letting the community see that history and how vibrant it was, I think it’s just so important that we understand what a rich history we have here.

Nijeul X: Yeah, I know the forest has been closed for 28 years, but even hearing you talk about the history that exists in the museum and that storytelling, how does that translate in the live performance space. We’ve talked about the visual arts in the making that happens at South Dallas Cultural Center. I’m curious how to use storytelling in various ways, or story-making, in order to also hold that history. Lots of elders that I’ve been speaking to since my arrival have been talking about, “keep the memory, tell the story, use the space, not only to showcase the art, but also to do what the schools are not able to do. What history teachers may not be able to say.” How do you use the artistic space in order to do that? I’m hoping there’s the opportunity to do that collaboratively, because arts institutions are more than that. They are civic. They are our new containers for that third place – for memory, history, storytelling,

VanAnthony Williams: Yeah, I really do believe that. Particularly, the Freedmen’s Town exhibition. Is there an artist that’s a part of that as well? 

Lisa Brown Ross: The curator is Phillip Collins. So we, over the years, were able to gather a lot of artifacts before the destruction of Freedmen’s Town. So, it’s almost like walking back in time. And I love what you said, what you just said. You’re making my mind, the wheels of my head just turn about, you know, about making it available in an artistic space where there is movement in dance. That is a collaboration.

VanAnthony Williams: And that’s what I was really going with. You know, just last month, we had an exhibition dedicated to the Freedmen’s Town, and using that as a collaborative experience to bring folks to the museum to see a performance. Those are the ways that we can have some synergy in connecting the pieces, right? Because we do have opportunities, unique opportunities, amongst our institutions that can highlight a specific aspect of our shared history,

Lisa Brown Ross: I agree. And Nigel, you said something that sparked my thought process too, and that is, you said, “protecting our memory.” So right now we have an exhibit called Protecting Cultural Memory. The artist is called Mr. Imagination. And he had an experience. He was from Chicago. He was shot in the stomach, went into a coma, and he just had all these visions. And so he took ordinary objects and created amazing art. But the thought of protecting cultural memory, and I asked Margie Reese, who is our chief programs officer, “How did you think about that? Where did that come from?” Because to me, it’s brilliant, protecting cultural memory. So it’s not just looking at history, right? It is protecting the memory of that history. And I think that is part of the calling. 

Nijeul X: I’ll take it a step further. 

Lisa Brown Ross: Okay, come on now.

Nijeul X: Because memory is a part of it. And what I’ve been thinking a lot about is imagination and innovation. We’ve been talking about this. Oh, I’m getting chills thinking about it, because we are some innovative people. And I don’t know if there’s a generation of both young people and just people who don’t realize the amount of things that black folks have created, making ways out of no way, and how that creative process contributes to our ability to thrive and survive. And because of the artistic space – especially the performing side – but I think across disciplines, if we give people a process to create and imagine – what is possible? And I’m grateful that the Forest has both the historic stage, where you can see the créme de la créme performing artist, and there’s a maker space where you can make things yourself. There’s a pathway, a pipeline, and I’m excited. I’m probably talking over myself, but I think it’s the memory and also the ability to imagine and innovate using the creative arts and performing arts that I’m super excited about building a container for.

Lisa Brown Ross: And think about that looking at our children and looking at the next generation. What you just said, if we can create a space where the children can learn, and see, and imagine, then it takes the top off of their heads, and then that pours in opportunities for them to think, “I can do this. I can.” In an environment so many times that says, “No, you can’t,” or not giving our children all of the information, or, you know, trying not to talk about the historical aspects of the brilliance and the overcoming and the perseverance and the tenacity of African American people. But I think it’s important, probably now more than any time in history, that we create those spaces so that they can learn and grow. 

VanAnthony Williams: Where their entrepreneurial experience comes from, because it’s embedded in all of us.

Lisa Brown Ross: Yes

VanAnthony Williams: Deeply rooted.